The Killing Joke: A bad day or a good movie?

Hi Everyone, prepare yourselves for a long-ass post!

Recently we watched The Killing Joke Bluray. We'd been looking forward to this ever since I (Jamie) squealed when they announced it in Ballroom 20 of SDCC last year.

We've got a fair bit to say about this so let's get down to business.

The DC fan base is so dedicated that no movie, live action or otherwise, will ever live up to expectations. DC is doomed to never please everyone, despite how they try to cater to all markets.

That is clearly the case with The Killing Joke.

MAT here I stole the post while she's feeding bub, firstly, we really enjoyed the movie, we wouldn't rate it as the best DC animated movie but it was still a good ride. Since seeing it we've seen a lot of reviews which have had a whole lot of hate for this movie, especially the first section (an add on story about batgirl) some hate it for not being part of the original comic, others for the relationship between Batgirl and Batman, some just feel it isn't the same tone of the rest of the movie.

Personally I'm pretty sure I know what they were going for, DC animated have been creating a universe for years, it roughly follows the current comic continuity but never exactly to the comics themselves, for example Flashpoint Paradox, Justice league War and Throne of Atlantis all directly follow stories leading up to and continuing into the new 52 run of comics but change small things about them to make the movies more accessible to the average viewer (no pre reading homework needed).
This story was written well before the New 52 so it would be out of the order, but due to fan requests and the fact that Mark Hamill stated he'd never play joker again unless it was this story, the decision was made to make it. and I think they did a good job of fitting it in their animated universe.

Jamie's back! Hi guys.
Ok. Time to get into spoiler territory so I can say what we liked/didn't like. So this is your official spoiler warning!

Right, so we have read the original graphic novel, we own it in hardback, we all know it is a classic. What was good?

• After Act 1 (the Barbara backstory), this movie is pretty much an exact, word for word of the comic. It's fantastic that so much effort was made to stay true to the original script. With a story this good, you don't need to modify it. 
• The voice actors. Kevin Conroy as Batman (let's face it. He IS Batman), Mark Hamill as Joker (he is truly the Joker), Tara Strong as Batgirl, pretty sure we heard some sneaky John DiMaggio in there too. I'm sure most of you know Conroy and Hamill voiced these characters in Batman: The Animated Series. It is such a treat to have them back, even though this version of Batman and Joker are very different to the characters they played in BTAS.
• Pacing: Some people will say "but the first act makes it drag out in runtime", yeah, true, but once the action starts, you're off to the races and we really didn't notice the runtime.
• This one is a bit of a love/hate. Animation. When we saw the trailer for this and saw the animation wasn't the same style as previous films (see my personal fave Flashpoint Paradox), we were a little worried that it would take us out of the story. It didn't really. I understand the animators were attempting to emulate the art style of the comic artists and they came pretty close. When Joker has his flashback of his origin story, the scene where he has just been affected by the chemicals and starts laughing at the end of his "one bad day" is pretty close to the original (and so SO classic) Brian Bolland art. I love this art so much I have a jacket with it on the back. It's seriously fantastic.

What was bad?

• Yeah, sometimes the animation didn't seem as polished as it could be, but adapting such a unique style to animation must be incredibly difficult.
• We honestly don't think Act 1 was bad. Was the sex scene necessary? well, that can be argued, but I think it was put in there so people new to the Batman universe could see that there was something at stake for Batman as well, not just "helping the Commissioner and his daughter" as it COULD have come across without the prologue. Think about it. If you had no idea about Batman, and you just started watching from the Killing Joke section of the film, would the stakes be high enough for Batman to kill the Joker? A man who he wouldn't even kill when Jason Todd was killed? (if you don't know what I'm talking about, watch Under The Red Hood, you won't be disappointed). And yes, I know the "killing" of the Joker is left as a bit of a "did he or didn't he" Schrodinger-type thing, but I like to think Batman finally killed that piece of garbage. So dark. 
• Maybe not the best story to adapt to film. We love the story, but as a film, we enjoy previous DC animations so much more. We don't think it's the fault of the animation team or that there's something wrong with the story itself, just that this isn't the best medium to convey this tale.

Right, back to Mat...sorry we're chopping and changing here!

A lot of the reviews complain about the art style, I do realize Jamie just mentioned it but they were trying to combine 2 art styles into one movie, the DC animated style and the original comic style, instead of pissing off one group completely they tried to meet everyone half way but that seems to have just angered the masses.

OK now I need to mention the sex scene, personally it's not my favorite version of the Batman/Batgirl relationship (I've seen a lot of the later cartoons where he's more of a mentor /father figure than a partner) but that's my preference I honestly cannot deny that they ever had that kind of relationship, I've been told it was in the early comics and the Batman beyond cartoon cemented it as canon.

I know it's getting a bit long winded at this point, but the other night we were watching reviews to see if anyone liked the movie the same way as we did or to see how other people interpreted the same movie. I think Variant comics were closest in opinion to us overall.



There was one review which actually almost angered me personally I think she missed the point, normally I love Steph Cozza at Aggressive Comics but her review of this movie seemed to turn into a bit of contradictory ramblings which I think most of her thoughts may need rebuttal.


So rebuttal -

Well ....

I've became distracted I started watching her review again so I could list things she said and then put down my comments / thoughts (she does contradict herself a bit) but she's just taken the fun out of everything.

She made a statement that she loves Alan Moore's work, but her evangelical devotion to The Killing Joke Graphic novel is at odds with his own views on it, I'd read interviews previously where he hates what that book has done to Batman, this was meant to be his darkest moment, not an average day at the office like later writers have continued, I tried to find the original article I read (so I could quote)

one such interview -
https://www.inverse.com/article/14967-alan-moore-now-believes-the-killing-joke-was-melodramatic-not-interesting

I could go on but it would sound like a hate rant on Steph and normally I really enjoy her reviews, I do recommend reading the article from inverse.com.

Loving Alan Moore's work but not acknowledging his feelings about it is equivalent to those people a few years ago wearing all the Von Dutch merchandise. Von Dutch was the least commercial man on earth and his heirs selling his name as a brand was despicable.

But I've gotten off topic. It's a good movie, not great but not deserving of the hate, I suggest you go watch it, make up your own mind. The more support the DC animated movies get, the more they'll make, and the animated movies are the ones DC and Warner Bros have been getting right.

                                                                                                               MAT


 

Suicide Squad

Hi Everyone,

So we just saw Suicide Squad. Now I don't know what the hell movie 99% of reviewers saw, but we LOVED what we watched! I was honestly prepared for another BvS, but was thankfully surprised.

Now I might cop some hate for this (meh, so be it) but I'm a big fan of the Amanda Conner, New 52 Harley Quinn comics. It's my guilty little pleasure comic that never fails to make me giggle. That said, I also enjoy the classic Harley comics and of course her representation in Batman The Animated Series. I am also a reader of Suicide Squad and New Suicide Squad and I love the path she's taken throughout the series. I think she's cheeky, brash, rough around the edges, but also loving and fiercely loyal. I think that really was captured well by the writers, director and of course Margot Robbie.

 

There were always going to be people who hated it because it's not a cinematic masterpiece. But no shit, what did you expect here? It's the f-ing Suicide Squad! If you've ever read a Suicide Squad comic, it IS chaotic and disjointed. That's the whole point. So whether it was deliberately put together that way by David Ayer, or it's just a happy coincidence, we thought that was perfect Comic to Screen.

Ok, now into actual spoiler territory. So if you haven't seen the movie and don't want it spoiled. blah blah blah, you know the rest. THIS IS YOUR SPOILER WARNING:

So many little fan service or comic references in this film that made us smile. I was so happy with Harley. A lot of people aren't but I'm just so pleased. People are also ripping on Leto's Joker, but really, the only thing I can fault is that I'm still not a fan of the grill. I can look past the tattoos, but those teeth. Blergh! I thought the relationship was great between Harley and Mr. J and that the flashbacks and origin story were so well done. The Harley/Batman kiss made me smile in particular. But oh wow! Did anyone else see in the flashback the blatant reference to the Alex Ross cover of Harley Quinn? You know the one...
Yeah, this one. If I wasn't in a cinema with other people I think I would've let out a little squee. Whoever thought of putting in that little few seconds of footage of Leto and Robbie dressed EXACTLY as this cover, bravo, standing ovation, two thumbs up....yeah you get what I'm saying.

Now I need a moment to talk about Boomer. He's been well represented (Assault on Arkham) and poorly represented (Arrow. Seriously WTF with that interpretation. No! Bad Berlanti-verse!) and this was thankfully in the well done category. Jai Courtenay did an awesome job playing Captain Boomerang. I just wish he had more screen time. I really like the variety of boomerangs he had. It wasn't just the boring old sharpened boomerangs.

Ok, this is getting to be a super long post so I'll just quickly go over the rest of my points.

Croc was awesome, got heaps to do in the film, but more dialogue would have been nice. And yes, Croc, you are beautiful! I thought Katana was wonderful and we wouldn't be surprised if she doesn't get a standalone movie out of this. Rick Flag ultimately gaining unspoken respect for Deadshot was well executed on screen. Enchantress was alright, but her brother wasn't totally necessary for the plot except to supply her with energy and well, to be a way for El Diablo to bite the dust/be redeemed in some way. That bar scene...seeing the characters react the way they did to Diablo's failings was very interesting and great viewing. I loved Boomer's saddened/disgusted, Deadshot not knowing what to say, and Harley's outrage. It really showed a lot about the true values for them. Oh, which reminds me... CONSPIRACY THEORY TIME!!!

I found an article/review online that also supported this theory of mine, so... in the "joker lying on the ground surrounded by guns" scene, there's baby clothes in that flat lay. It looks odd yes? like, odd even for the Joker, odd. Harley was also MEGA pissed at Diablo for even thinking he could have a normal life and have kids without them being hurt/killed. THEN in her "fantasy sequence" we see her and Mr J all happy families with twin babies. SO.........was Harley pregnant at some stage and lost her babies? Is this something we'll see fleshed out in future movies? Any Harley fan will tell you that in the Injustice universe, Harley has a daughter called Lucy that the Joker doesn't know about so maybe the writers used that as a jumping off point? Clearly all speculation.

can't half tell that I'm super pumped after seeing this movie... sorry for all the ramblings.

I'll finish this on one last notable mention.
Amanda Fucking Waller.
Viola Davis IS Amanda Waller. No shit. She is amazing and just so perfectly written it was like the comic came to life. She's ruthless and brutal and strong and takes no shit from anyone. So perfect. I need a sequel just for more Waller. And that after credits scene was perfectly ripped from the final scenes in Assault on Arkham and I couldn't be happier. She's such a badass.

So, I'm all done now. What did you all think about it? Comment, Subscribe, let us know you're out there.
Until next time...

Love ya Puddins!

Jamie :)

Finally, A Comic Con Post

Hi Everyone,

I know, I know, I said I'd post something about Comic Con sooner than this. Since anyone that really cares has probably seen all the trailers already there's not really any point to me reposting my favourites is there?

I was pretty happy with the trailers and news that came out of Comic Con. DC (finally) stepped up their game and were a highlight to many reviewers. Especially for the Wonder Woman trailer. Of course I'm still going to be nervous of Justice League and Wonder Woman not being true to the source material. That said, I will go into each of those movies expecting the best.

I have to be honest with you all here for a minute. I was one of those people who was completely against the recasting of Flash in the movie universe. I love Grant Gustin's Barry Allen so much. I think it's so true to the personality conveyed in the literature (you know, except for him being brunette). BUT...I didn't hate Ezra Miller's Barry Allen in the trailer for JL. In fact, I chuckled a little at his awkwardness. While I still don't understand DC/WBs move of not combining the TV and Cinematic universes (really, why confuse both the fan base AND the general public? Bring in that tv show crowd!) I was pretty happy with what I saw. Oh an Jason Mamoa......holy sweet Poseidon

Ahem. So you're probably wondering (if you actually regularly read this blog), where our Suicide Squad review is. Well, with a baby, and Mat's busy work schedule, we haven't been able to see it yet. This week we are hoping to while bub is at school. I know there's been a lot of negativity, but I don't care.

Other Comic Con highlights for me. Hmm. Oh, John Barrowman's cosplay. Outrageous as always, he did one of the best Zapp Brannigan cosplays I've seen. So impressed. Also did a squirrel girl cosplay and a classic Harley Quinn cosplay. So brilliant. Anyone up for a good laugh should check out his panel from SDCC this year (or any other year really). I'll link it here.




Since we didn't go this year, there's not really that much else to discuss. I didn't really look at any merch as I honestly didn't want to upset myself knowing that I wouldn't be able to purchase it! I know, I'm weird.

I'll be going back to work in a few weeks but hopefully between now and then I write a few more blogs. I've been a bit lazy so again, sorry about that.

Have a great week and remember, You're not weird, you're limited edition.

Jamie :)

I'm completely sold on the new Wonder Woman

As some people may know(at least those people following the current DC run of comics) Rebirth is in full swing, and I've decided to give the first 3 or so issues of all the titles a read and re establish my regular reads.

I'd always enjoyed Wonder Woman in the Justice League comics but I'd never had the urge to read her solo stories before, until now. I'm currently up to issue 4 of her rebirth run and I'm completely sold, amazing art and a story with just the right amount of mystery to make me look forward to continuing.

I'll definitely be reading her future stories for the foreseeable future.

                                                                                                       MAT